U.S. Marines Are Landing – And Taliban Knows All About It
The United States Marines, America’s best and bravest, are about to land in the Town of Marja, southern Afghanistan. The news is already out. Meetings have gone on for weeks to alert the Marja townspeople. The tribal elders know about it. It’s in the Los Angeles Times. It’s all over Afghanistan. Hell and the entire World know it. And the Taliban Soldiers of Allah know it.
The Marines have been instructed not to shoot back if there are civilians in the line of fire. Protecting Afghanistan civilians’ lives must count for more than American lives. It’s CIC Barack Obama and General Stanley McChrystal’s standing order. The Taliban will probably position themselves among civilians. Or they may just run away, re-group and come back later. Knowing the invasion is coming they’ve had months to mine the terrain with Improvised Explosive Devices (IEDs), like the one that sent my nephew home from his first Iraq tour with a Purple Heart. This is no way to win a War – not any War I ever heard of.
The Los Angeles Times’ Tony Perry and Laura King have the story here:
“Reporting from Kabul, Afghanistan, and Camp Leatherneck, Afghanistan — Heading into battle to seize a Taliban stronghold, U.S. Marines are keenly aware of one factor that could snatch defeat from the jaws of victory: Afghan civilian casualties.
Deaths of noncombatants in clashes involving Western troops and insurgents are one of the bitterest points of contention between President Hamid Karzai and his foreign allies. So in the weeks leading up to the imminent offensive to take the Helmand River Valley town of Marja in southern Afghanistan, the Marines’ commander, Brig. Gen. Larry Nicholson, sat with dozens of Afghan tribal elders, drinking endless cups of sweet tea and offering reassurances that his top priority will be the safety of Afghan civilians…
… The Marja operation has been publicized for months by the Marines. One reason Nicholson has taken that unusual step is to give civilians plenty of warning, decreasing the chances they will be caught in crossfire…”
The Afghanistan front in this World War is a guerilla war, an “insurgency”, as it’s been called. The enemy wears no uniform. He lives among the non-combatants and dresses as they do. The Soviets invaded there once. Remember?
The United States Revolutionary War was a guerilla War. The Brits had the best equipped standing Army in the World. They lost to Washington’s rag-tag Continental Army and the militias.
Don’t get me wrong, here. I’m not any kind of pacifist. I come from a family with a U.S. military history that goes clear back to the Civil War. The United States Marine Corps is the finest fighting unit in the history of the World. But it was not created to act as a civilian police department in a Muslim State. This whole strategy is tantamount to putting a full-page announcement in The L.A. Times that the cops are about to do a big drug raid on a house full of dope and automatic weapons, complete with the address of the targeted house. You tell me what would happen next.
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You can't win a war by politicizing it. War is hell, and if there is no comittment to winning it by letting the
troops on the ground do what they are trained to do–that is annihilate the enemy, then to hell with the
politicians. What kind fo game do they think they're playing? There's going to be a lot of blood on their
hands.
Am I missing something here? Isn't the element of tactical surprise essential in an asymmetrical conflict? Let's say you're the Taliban. You're big and tough because you like to beat up women who don't dress in an Islamic manner and you get to stone whomever you want then WHAM! – the Marines show up to spoil your fun. The look of sheer terror on their faces would be priceless! Isn't it GREAT that the Taliban can place all manner of mines all over the place ahead of the Marines' arrival? BHO and McChrystal are duds. Get rid of them before they place the lives of any more Americans in danger.
There's an unwritten covenant between the military and our government. In essence, the government tells us when we enlist, that while we may risk our lives, and even lose our lives, the government promises never to WASTE our lives. As a former Marine from the late 60's, I can tell you that this covenant was broken by LBJ & Robert McNamara for the first time during the Vietnam war, when they started using us as expendable political pawns.
Obama seems to care even less about the military than LBJ did, and I'm guessing that he'll wind up wasting far more of our military's precious lives before his disgraceful administration is over.
Swemson,
Thank you, sir, for your service to our country.
JW
Help me to refresh my memory but wasn't Geraldo ousted from combat reporting for giving away the location of our troops?
How is theis different? We need to oust a whole lot of these American troop deniers.
Yes, Linda. You are correct.
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/31/sprj.ir...
Thanks for reading along and commenting.
JW
By advertising the attack the Taliban have two choices: A) flee like impotent cowards which looks bad in manly tough culture, or B) stand and fight a pitched battle they cannot win….air power along will wipe them out. McCrystal is counting on their cowardice…..they will run and hide outside the town or among the population ….. the Marines will take control of the town with less casualties….go house to house looking for sappers and weapons….. and garrison the town. The Taliban will regroup, find another town to control, and the process will repeat. This is a shell game if I ever saw one. To maintain an army, even revolutionaries, the logistics of supplying food to combatants is a big problem. That requires support from the civilian population who provide food. We should attack their food, water, and health the way Sherman attacked the infrastructure of Georgia….the March to The Sea. If several million Afgans begin to starve- believe me- their ability and desire to support the Taliban will stop.
The Marines have been instructed not to shoot back if there are civilians in the line of fire. Protecting Afghanistan civilians’ lives must count for more than American lives.
Hell No! If you are sending them in to combat with those rules, just let the Taliban have afghanistan. If you don't even give them the right to shoot back, (for fear of hitting a civilian,) then why put them there in the first place? The Marines aren't beat cops, and if one marine dies, we need to sue Obama and McCrystal for endangering our soldiers needlessly.
What's next? Take away their guns and give them billy clubs?
I have several friends who are Marines. I know their dedication and tradition for honoring their corps. They will always do as they are told. If just one Marine dies because of these insane orders, there needs to be more action than simply a lawsuit against McCrystal and Obama. It is increasingly apparent that our POTUS' loyalties lie far more with the Muslim world than with our own. The more Marines he is able to "dispose of" the easier time he'll have handing over our country to Islam. I, for one, am quite worried for our troops, and indeed, the country they have pledged to defend.
Betty,
I share your worries. My nephew, an Army vet of three Iraq combat deployments, will at some point be sent to Afghanistan. It's not our troops who are failing. It's their upper brass and The White House who are betraying them by putting them in this situation with these ROE.
Best,
JW
marja is just one district. in afghanistan taliban controling 10 districts completly and about 100 districts exept district centar. nato have not enough soldiers to clear teritorium and control long border with pakistan. they need 600000 soldiers and it is imposible. in 2004 it was 400 taliban now is 30000. in falluja marines attacked with large number tanks and armored carriers but in marja will be infantry battle and taliban are in good position. here are some of districts completly control by taliban. washir, baghran, dishu, ghorak, gizab, kajran, miya nishin, qarabagh, ajristan, kamdesh, khas uruzgan, chahar burja…..
"taliban are in good position"
Yes. Well, they've had lots of advance notice and time to dig in.
JW
Send Obama in as point .
With all due respect to any and all who has ever served in defense of our nation, I must say the following:
There once was a tactical operation conducted in Mogadishu that was restricted with a similar "don't shoot back…" policy. As I recall, to my heartfelt sorrow for the loss of the brave soldiers engaged, it didn't go well. Similarly, limitations were placed on our troops throughout the fighting in Viet Nam. Why, on earth would we employ such a policy again?
Men and women put in harm's way, being shot at with the obvious intent to kill, cannot be politically nor emotionally limited by an obsessive concern for the Political Correctness of their defensive response. All of us can be certain that an American Soldier would never kill indiscriminately. This has been well demonstrated by the tremendous outpouring of help from our forces, for the citizens of Iraq and earlier in Kuwait.
Only someone who detests military action, as well as those whom are tasked with the responsibility, would place limitations on our soldiers' need to defend themselves. This is the type of political decision that may only increase the loss of more of our brave fighting men and women.
There was an incident about 2 years ago where a unit was going into Diyala Province in Iraq-word leaked out before they got there and they were ambushed. I had an FRG at the time (family readiness group leader) for the company my son was in and she was the Captains wife. This was not my son's company but a sister company. I was so furious over the ambush that it went all the way to the PAO in Baghdad. What I was told through communiques between my FRG and the PAO was that I had to remember the time difference…well it had nothing to do with that as I am well aware of how many hours difference there is between the US and the middle east. The insurgents knew they were coming and had RPG's and small arms fire waiting for them as soon as they hit the outer perimeter of the town they were goung in to. I to this day believe it was published BEFORE they got to Diyala. Because of that we lost some soldiers and two Strykers. It was a horrific mistake that no one will take responsibility for and I see it is still going on. Talk about it after the fact-not before. I am so angry I do not have the words to express it.-
We might as well give our soldiers nerf guns so we can cater to the no hurting civilians order.
I share in your sadness, and anger. When we first sent troops to Iraq, I was more hopeful for a positive outcome. I felt more confident in the troops safety with the assurance that decisions would be made by those on the ground. A soldier's confidence rises when his/her own leaders can exercise control over the chaos.
Admittedly, there have been mistakes in unwittingly relaying information. We once believed the insurgents watched CNN to get a heads-up on the next military action. Unfortunately, once command and control breaks down, most everything does. Hence, the premature release of the news. We have learned this time and again yet we repeat it.
The President's need to micromanage military affairs comes from both his personal insecurity and lack of trust in his Command Officers. The President is insecure in his abilities to wage war and his lack of trust arises from a need to closely manage his image while America is on the World Stage. He prioritizes his image over the successful outcome of a military campaign. This is similar to the "World Opinion" sentiments of John Kerry in his failed Presidential bid. This is a crippling mentality, and it has haunted this nation since LBJ and Richard Nixon submitted to it while we were in the Viet Nam. Unfortunately, placing focus on what is acceptable in war and the obsessive concern for what other nations think, even as we defend ourselves, continues in the minds of many of the politicians who reached maturity under the influence of the Viet Nam War protests.
War, once declared, needs to be managed by the warriors. Once a strategy is agreed upon and deployed, the politicians cannot interfere in the tactics. The Commander in Chief must trust that his Commanders will lead our troops with integrity, and that our troops will fight with honor.
Do we have an Exit strategy for the entire USA?
Maybe a little Vietnam War smarts is in order for
the troops. A wise Colonel confronted the troops
about to deploy in-country. He gave a legaleese
speach. After he left the Captain was asked what
it meant. If we are shot at, kill them, if they
shoot at me, kill them twice.
Obama is NOT a CIC! He is a loser and has surrounded himself with losers, wearing the same uniform that our heroes have worn. These kinds of "rules for dis-engagement" do not belong in a war. The idiot should just bring out troop home instead of having them die in this farce! There never was nor ever will be a war in which civilians are casualties. This is the kind of nonsense advocated only in Hollywood movies and lunatic fantasies. Get our troops out you moron!
"Civilians? I didn't see any civilians." Carpet bomb with neutrons, it's the practical thing to do.